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How do I make money as an artist without paywalling everything? Most artists do not live off commissions but off their patreon.
I've been a pirate all my life and I want to be fair with my other fellow pirates but charging over 500$ for a commissions that everyone will see in the end is not going to float in the market.


I will note right off the bat that if you don't have enough of an audience, you will not see significant amounts of money, paywall or no paywall, Patreon or not Patreon. If that is the case, you should be more worried about advancing your technical skills and speeding up your workflow.
If that is not the case;
There are hundreds of services (Redbubble, Teespring, Printful, to name a few) that will handle everything beginning to end. All you have to do is upload the images and accept the money, while I get decent shit to wear and put on my walls.
>Digital products
If you do it correctly, I don't consider such things "paywalling," and will happily pay for a comic or collection on Gumroad. But, it must be stressed that it needs to be handled with care. The price must be fair, you need to lay out what exactly I am receiving, preferably with some kind of preview, alt versions of the same image need to be kept to a proportional minimum, and you cannot sell things that were already distributed for free at any point, including anything resembling a paid "archive".



>Doujinshi/physical product
Separate from merchandise, this is actually selling mass-printed artbooks in a physical manner. To be clear, I know absolutely nothing about how this is setup in practice, but what I do know is that I attend every single Comiket and buy every decent zine collaboration I come across. The novelty never goes away.
Yes, it doesn't scale in current year and should be abandoned past a certain point; no, it is not as easy or smooth as everything else, but what it definitely would be is, quite literally, the oldest and most tested form of art business the human race knows of. At least look at your options and consider if you can make it work.



I think there's this false dichotomy in play where you think that if you don't paywall your art, then nobody will pay for it. But, and I have no data on this, I imagine you'd still get a sizeable portion of people supporting you even if all of your patreon content is freely available.

I suppose the only real evidence for this I have is that despite kemono's rapidly increasing userbase, I haven't seen any decline in subs for artists (at least from the ones I follow).

Anyways, best of luck.


I love these ideas, I have made (non lewd) zines before, they didn't sell but having them in your hands was so good, I became an artist because I love american comics and with a new lewd audience I will have the market to put out more zines. you can read them online for free but just like american comics owning them is a different sort of fun.
I could also offer prints, I always wanted to make woodblock prints but I'm not sure if I can send furry porn through the mail.
I just feel one needs a really big audience to live off their good will


Please, don't listen to the moron. I hate Japanese for basically holding an artist hostage by hiring him and all his art is available only trough fucking merch. I would much rather pay him on patreon if it means I am getting digital high res and maybe even a psd.
No matter what mentally ill commies on a welfare say, patreon is not the problem, how artists set up their rewards is. I am not too happy to pay for a cat in a bag random art that may or may not be produced during the course of the month without having access to previous work.


some of the artists i follow go the tip jar route, the "see it first on x" kind and then release it in a month or so, or have the psd x high quality png's behind a paywall


You could release art early for patreon subscribers and release it for the public later


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>Charging OVER $500 for a commi-

With that kind of asking price, I assume you're much more skilled than "the average highly skilled internet artist"?

Can we see some of your art so we can get an impression of how justifiable that asking price is, in terms of quality/skill etc?

In any case, I think if you're good enough be able to charge between £300-500+ with a straight face, then I'd be very surprised if you aren't ALREADY making good money as an artist, and/or have a considerably large following.

I think unless your work is amazing, and atleast somewhat recognisable, then you're probably going to have a hard time shifting comms for that kind of price! UNLESS you're lucky and a couple rich kids get into your work (which of course, could happen).

>The pic represents a rich kid; just the kind of clientele you're going to need. Good luck!



Right. Its just logical. There will always be "goody 2 shoes" types and "naughty bastard" types existing together. There will always be people who "were ALWAYS going to pay, even if pirate sources ARE available", and people who "were never going to pay, because I WOULD download a house".

Hardline paywallers might THINK they're making more money by releasing nothing freely, but I doubt it really makes much difference. Negligable at best, but I too have no data lol.


>I just feel one needs a really big audience to live off their good will

I can only guess (as I don't try to push my art out there) but I'd presume you'd need to have a considerably big following to live off internet fanart/original-art etc in general, regardless of business model.

Live-off as in "enough to quit your old job"; then you'd need to make more than £1000 per month, which, for an average internet artist among 10 billion others, sounds like quite a lot, atleast to me in this specific context (IE a highly insecure type of self employment with zero guarantees or fallbacks).


I'm not into anime so I'm not familiar with your case but I admit it's unfair and I didn't had in mind selling any merch without letting people see it digitally anyway
As I said I don't think I can live off a tip jar and a timed paywall isn't different from a permanent one.
Oh no, I was using 500$ as an example of what I would have to charge to brake even just from commissions. I have a background on fine art and can produce fully rendered paintings with rich backgrounds but the furry stuff I've made is crummy and not really worth that much.
I too believe in this thesis, my concern is that I want to be fair with the people who will never pay since I'm one of them.
I'm well aware of things being like this, I just feel hentai/furry has a lower entry bar


Can we see your art? Just for something new to look at for a bit. What styles themes do you do? Any fantasy, futurism, surrealism, figure art, landscapes etc?

I'm into all sorts of art, and don't worry about criticism, I tend to only comment on what I like about a pic.


>I'm well aware of things being like this, I just feel hentai/furry has a lower entry bar

I agree. I can't deny I've seen artists on sites like R34 and thought "how can they be this succesful given the amateur quality of their work?".

Looking at the top 3 most faved artists on this site made me think the same thing again lol. The 9th most faved artist here is IMO tonnes more skilled than the top 3, and the top artist just looks to me like the same as 80% of other typical cutesy-hentai artists. Nothing stands out about it at all, and the quality is only average, yet somehow he's more popular than any of the others. Its madness lol :P


well easy, the only method you can try is make your patreon more as a "tip jar" than a paywall. for example i will be referencing ruaidri, and iztil, both of this artist has done the "tip jar" mothod. They release a hi res on e6 and make their patreon as a "early bird" which mean they will get the animation first before its released to public. you could also try releasing a 4k res to public but make the 6k on patreon/substar to avoid being printed and resold (although it still happen even if you put it behind paywall)

>but charging over 500$ for a commissions that everyone will see in the end is not going to float in the market.

mdf moment


As I s/aid I already posted all the good stuff I have on my vanilla socials and I don't want to be tracked from here to there.
Terrifying madness, I fear the audience I may find.
>mdf moment
Medium density fiberboard?


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Bless you for not knowing who MDF is. Bless your little cotton socks.


I don't know what it is either. But I HAVE made a small set of drawers using MDF once.


BBS screwing up again lol. First your post doesn't appear, so you wait, refresh. Still doesn't appear so I try & write it out again. Then BOTH appear ATST FFS lol.


Just use it for shit like 6kHD+, wips/source files, 1-2 week early access dumbass, and polls/voting dumbass, you can even make it so commissions are exclusive to a tier and sure, people'll bitch, but guess what?
No one'll give a real shit in the end because you're not actually restricting content, just limiting how much you can be spammed with commission purchases, and fuck, if someone has the money to spend on that they're probably willing to throw an extra $20 or someshit on top and it won't matter


What a fucking faggot


I take it Miles DF is NOT who I was thinking of then, seeing as those comments about him were mysteriously "shadow deleted"?


deduped too many comments. apologies. Board also fucking up for me too


inb4 thread turns into an MDF hate thread


sweaty they're called rubles why do you hate ruskie so much?

>>18492 >>18493
look mate if your gonna delete stuff PLEASE use the archiver first the happenings aren't gonna save themselves
>money dlc fraud hate thread
aren't hate threads banned by the old YPbbs? (just need a clarification)

can i have free samples how good was it? i heard there was a guy scanning rare book/magazines but he coudn't get the positions right so the 4channers hated him


Is this your art? If not, it would be cool to see it (even though I know some people still care about anonymity in an obscure porn board.)
>How do I make money as an artist without paywalling everything? Most artists do not live off commissions but off their patreon.
I've been a pirate all my life and I want to be fair with my other fellow pirates but charging over 500$ for a commissions that everyone will see in the end is not going to float in the market.
Although I agree that 500$ is steep, if you can get away with it, all the more power to you. It principally doesn't matter what the input is as long as the product is still available for all of us to see. Go ahead and scam as much richfags as you can! Make your money, then worry about the ethics later. If you absolutely insist on going the paywall route, personally upload your shit for us. Otherwise I think there are inventive ways that don't go the paywall route. Firstly, you can go the soft paywall route by incentivising people to your patreon. You could release some images earlier for patreons, give patreons certain privileges, or you can even use certain tiers to fund projects like printings runs (as you mentioned in >>18338) that cover the costs of production and shipping. Secondly, you could open a donation with kofi, bitcoin, paypal, or whatever. You are a comic artist, so donations shouldn't be alien. A word of warning, though, Patreon is known for banning people that draw porn even if they never post it on-site. They're simply that possessive.


I've seen this artist but i don't care for his art enough to know he was this scummy.
>shit like 6kHD+, wips/source files,
Do people like that? WIPs are a thing but why would anyone want the source file for a picture?
>1-2 week early access dumbass,
May outrun kemono but still too short to incentivize people.
>and polls/voting dumbass,
I fear people will vote in shit I don't want, it's like flipping a coin, it'll only show you what you really want
>you can even make it so commissions are exclusive to a tier and sure,
That's still paywalling, I don't want to paywall commissions, it'll mean only rich dumbasses with more money than brains will commission me their same OCs all the time.
>can i have free samples how good was it? i heard there was a guy scanning rare book/magazines but he coudn't get the positions right so the 4channers hated him
>Is this your art? If not, it would be cool to see it (even though I know some people still care about anonymity in an obscure porn board.)
No, that one is by R.Crumb and as i said I don't want to share my vanilla art and my hentai/furry stuff is not good.
Right now I don't think I can make a living off art but will be a nice side hustle, like I plan on opening commissions once a year and see how much can I rake of it and never open a patreon. Still selling zines and prints seems like the fairest way to be profitable if I ever get to that point but I've also thought of streaming my art process and have gimmicks like if you want your commission to be done now you'll have to pay extra or if you want to talk with me you'll have to pay for the call and stuff like that.
I don't know man, I want to make a living off art but it feels so distant.


File: 1648533099714.jpg (19.83 KB, 620x248, this-is-the-worst-club-pro….jpg)

You give off 𝘵𝘩𝘦𝘴𝘦 vibes.


Haha I don't hate the Ruskies man XD

I don't remember much about Zelda but IIRC Rupees is the same name as Indian currency (I don't know what inspired Tendo to use the name of Indias money, but hey). Its as blatant as making a fictional currency & calling it "Pence/Pounds".

There ain't even any Indian looking people in Zelda. Nintendo, explain your decision!


He's a good lad. He brings the random laughs, and that keeps shit balanced, so I like having him around.


Are you into Robert Crumb then? I didn't realise it was him but it slightly reminds me of a (ironically non erotic) pic he did of himself (?) drawing and the voice of 'the terrible one' is telling him to "DRAW, you bastard!" and he's like "But, but I don't want to draw".

I don't know how well known the bloke is in UK but I got really into him (but not physically) when I discovered him a few years back. Maybe he's a rabid misogynist who wouldn't survive 2 mins in today's SJW world but that just makes him more interesting. He did some realistic pics I liked even more. 2 Black women with massive fat asses, and some fat assed Latina on a bike. Even turned out he was obsessed with vinyl & music which always makes me smile!


>Polls & voting and "Draw what WE want, not what YOU want!"

Thats one of the main reasons I've always been reluctant to go the paysite route with my own art, despite a number of people saying I'm stupid not to (and in a business sense, being exactly right lol). When I draw I draw "for me". I'm only really interested in drawing "what I want to see". I can think of hardly a single franchise I'm into enough to dedicate hours making fanart of. I like LOOKING at fanart but to me, making it is boring compared to original characters.

I've seen it on Paytreon where "the voice of the people" holds the artist ransom ("Stop drawing original art and draw Naruto FFS! Stop using your imagination!!") NEARLY as much as certain (greedy) artists hold their Patrons ransom ( "If you peasants don't start paying more, I'll never draw again!" ).

Thats almost definitely why you see so many Paytreon artists disappearing and coming up with blatantly fake excuses. They clearly get worn down by constant nagging pressure to draw things they don't care about.


>Do people like that? WIPs are a thing but why would anyone want the source file for a picture?
I don't know but people do actively request these kinda things a lot from artists they're pledged to.
My best guess is it's to look at how they do their shading and such, but past that fuck if I know, people just like them.

>May outrun kemono but still too short to incentivize people.

As someone who has seen dozens of artists who have this exact kind of schedule and make plenty of cash from it, no it's not at all. The biggest issue is having an audience who's interested enough in your art to pay you for it in the first place, without that nothing you do is really going to be a quick and easy maximum profit maker. It's why so many twitter artists wait until they have between 500-1000 followers before suddenly opening up a patreon, at that point they have enough of a potential audience that if even a percent pledge at their lower tiers they're going to make a fair bit of dosh even if they don't post often.


>I fear people will vote in shit I don't want, it's like flipping a coin, it'll only show you what you really want
That's why you decide what the options are, or at least have a list of exclusions for what they can vote on.
That way you can ensure whatever wins is something you won't mind doing.
Fuck, the polls can even be something as simple as 'decide on what wip I should finish first' or 'choose a previous piece I should draw a continuation of' if you're that antsy about shit, people will eagerly pay for that shit, just look at Notboogie and his bullshit.

>That's still paywalling, I don't want to paywall commissions, it'll mean only rich dumbasses with more money than brains will commission me their same OCs all the time.

Then either one, make it something as small as like, $5, or make it so they get discounts on the more expensive discount choice, there's a good few options that aren't a paywall.
Fucks sake, offering something as small as a free monthly semi-clean/sketch tied to a pledge tier that's slightly lesser than getting a commission of the same quality, is a 'benefit' I've seen dozens of artists use that consistently rakes in a fair bit for them.


Just don't give them the option to throw their own ideas in, only give them a selection of shit you're interested in and/or willing to do, change it up every poll, and they'll just go for whatever they're most interested in from the selection and be satisfied with it because they'll still be getting something they want
Hells, polls can be as simple as being made because you were feeling indecisive about something, like say, what pose to put a character in and you have a selection you're interested in, so you're letting them break the block for you so to speak, that way you're still doing something you want and they'll still be getting something they'll enjoy while also feeling like they're an 'important' part of the creative process (people love the feeling of being included, especially when it's an exclusive kind of inclusion)


>All options are things I'm already interested in.

Yea that makes perfect sense actually. I don't know how I didn't think of it that way :P


Eh, I'll say don't worry about it, for some reason not a lot of artists seem to realize they can just go this kind of route and people will be just as satisfied because they're still getting shit they want, more art from the artist, all they're doing is getting a say in what piece the artist should up in priority from whatever list of personal ideas they might have on hand


I do like artists like Crumb but i specially admire his inkwork.
Uh huh
Yes I have to build an audience first and now I see that by the process of building it I will know what stuff can I offer on my patreon.
making a bunch of sketches and then letting the patrons vote on which one gets finished sounds like a lot of work.


Sketches you were working on and hadn't finished yet, pieces you'd left as sketches because you got bored with at the time or got distracted from with another idea, or even just writing out ideas you had plans for but were debating over which to start first before you'd even put any to paper.
What, do you only draw one thing at a time and never have wips lying around, or focus on the one idea so wholly you don't think up a new one until you're done with the last, or someshit? Sounds like a pretty slow and inefficient system if you do


When I start a piece I commit to it. I do have a list of prompts to draw from but I could make a simple draft fr the patrons.


Boom badda bing, there you go! That's what you give them to vote on for polls, you don't even have to give them drafts if you're not feeling it either, just the list of prompts itself can work perfectly fine
It's a good way to set your schedule a bit, and you can still work on other pieces that didn't win on your own time so long as you try to get the winner out first


File: 1650146702000.png (1.09 MB, 1001x967, 12 abr 22.png)

OP here:
People asked for what does my art look like so I decided to use my holy week break to make this as a proof of concept.
I feel it will not click with most of you but I'm used to that.


File: 1650152935282.png (307.33 KB, 327x550, zamm.png)

If this is your art, you've got a solid footing in the industry. I personally like the aesthetics. Got a kinda warm feeling to it. The style is also quite unique, which makes it feel like more cartoony too.

Keep up the great work and I can see you growing in the future.


Not really into furry stuff, but the character low key kinda gives off a vibe of "ALF" if you heard of that 80s show which is kinda cool. It does have a nice vibe to it, not sure if youre going for an otherwoldy look or just the contrast of colors. Finding something there isnt much art done of that a lot of people think of/know of is a way to get the name out there. I think a lot of artists would be surprised to know how much demand there is for background/"scenery" art for indie games (if your pricing is fairly affordable). There is a market for non lewd/H sci fi/fantasy art. Not sure how big it is, but that does exist as well. People are always looking for game assets.


yea there're concept art / background position

unfortunately you don't really "grow" with these thing unless your drawing is "attractive"

every time I show my portfolio to my friend or teacher, they'll say "why don't you find an artist or similar job?"
and I'll keep saying "I'm trying and I'm still unemployed"

People who don't draw will think anyone with some sort of skill is incredible
but reality is this job is also highly competitive

You'll see that some people draw not that well become famous and some really high skill people don't get attention at all

ok, I wonder if 7-11 here still has job opening
To me, only "chosen one" can make a living out of drawing. It depends on if god like you or not


also there's a sad reality, connections are better than anything

one of my classmate send a drawing to his idol and somehow his idol post it on her facebook feed, boom, 80K follower in a week.

In all my tweets, the one with most reweets and likes is when I post a thinking emoji to Notch because he is shitposting and somehow he replied my tweet

In the end, the content and quality of your work really doesn't matter in the age of internet
(well I guess It's still matter, you can't draw shit that other people don't understand)


File: 1650177698093.png (1.1 MB, 1001x967, 12 abr 22.png)

BTW I added a highlight.
I think I mentioned that I have a background in fine art so yes the colours where chosen just for their aesthetics and used to archive that otherworldly look.
I'm sure I want to do lewd stuff, fine art with furries must be a really niche market and lewd stuff will be easier on the long run.
I know all of that, things have been really rough since I had an exhibition and nothing was sold. Fine art is a really hard career and the idiots of my parents pushed me into it without any safety net to fall into. I just want some easy money now.


Paywall shit normally, but make it easily accessible for free. Use paywall sites that are known to be scraped, Mega link to a master folder that never expire, embed images in the posts, etc.

The normies will pay, the privateers will find a way


Tis true, especially if you're willing to abandon all inhibitions and just go full monty deep dive into drawing the most degenerate of fetishes
I see fuckers like that who rake in fucking thousands a month despite drawing honestly fairly low ass quality art just because they're willing to draw mostly deviantart tier degen art


Makes sense but still not as fair as I'd like
I know, I'm into those really degenerate fetishes and I've seen people with -10 talent making money. I want to do fetish art but sometimes it feels that you can't be too god to excel there. In a previews piece I had made I was even told "You have to choose between making grandiose art and kink art but you can't do both" so I really don't know who my audience is.




hey paywalling isn’t wrong, go ahead and try it. if you never try you’ll never know if people would ever willing to pay or not and based from you art, i can say that you could try become a background artist? who knows, background artist can also make big bucks and if you sharpen your skill enough, try adding characters into it. making it more appealing to people. try make and art that suitable to be use as a wallpaper for desktop and phones.


>Reccomends paywalling
You forgot what site you're on didn't you whiteknightard?


well money don't grow on tree unless you wanna ask OP to work in 7-11 and draw kink art for fun

also I want to say, how much you can get from paywall depends on your audience size, you can estimate that around 0.5%~1% of people in your followers will actually pay money


Or just draw scat/vore, especially in really fucking disturbing looking sequences, of 'insert popular media with furfaggable creature(s) here' and you're guaranteed a solid starting point between 500-1k in just a few months of popping up


Or just don't paywall shit outside of like, wips/sketches and 6k hi-res, and instead use whatever pledge site you're on for other features than having 'exclusive art to make your pledgers feewl so specwial', you know, like he made this thread for people to recommend him ideas of, which people have been fucking doing
Maybe fucking read the thread next time retard?


Who the fuck got $500/1000+ drawing vore and scat? Give me example cause i'm curious. I understand that there are retarded people paying retarded artist who draw retarded stuff like fellatrix making rackets.. but scat? Damn.


I'll be completely honest, It's a good piece. But at the end of the day if you don't draw anime/furries/videogames fanart or lewd stuff then I say good luck making a living outside of commission or paywalling.

Also try to get an actual job no matter how shit it is meanwhile improving your skillset because even if you did get US$500 a month from your drawing and live under your mother's basement, it's still not going to be enough for most people. Art is such a niche market that only the one with talent and luck can actually make it. Not only you had $50k student debt for such a useless degree but you wasted thousand of hours of your time being depressed and making absolutely no money. The sooner you realize this the better.


If you are not interested in drawing characters or fanart, another option for you is to find a professional work although it probably require more skillset. As >>19714 mentioned there are always studios looking for background/concept artist. As a matter of fact a lot of decent Patreon artist actually had a professional background before they decided to quit and draw lewd stuff. You just need to find a good school(it doesn't have to be college) or mentor that actually know how to get you into the industry, if you're up for it.


Here's a guy who not only makes $500 (and I've seen his account usually middle between it and $600) but also does pretty low quality art for that kind of gain
https://www.patreon.com/Just_White/posts. Like he's making more compared to this user, https://www.patreon.com/RASHCHAOS/posts who makes honestly way more degenerate content (lot of guro/borderline, and some scat looking at his socials), but doesn't seem to also do vore, least not more graphic like the other guy, but also has honestly some pretty good quality art skills

I'd have to look around but I can recall at least a few who I've seen hit 1000+ now and again, but you're typically guaranteed a solid $500 minimum so long as you make degenerate art


yeah, I have to build an audience first and see what can I paywall and I don't want to be a professional on art related industries, they're full of overwork, hentai/furry will let me do art as a 40 hour workweek without needing more. Comic book artists work about 90 hours a week and in the video game industry it gets worse plus I don't have the network to land one of those jobs.
Thank god I didn't went to college to study fine art. After my art career faild I decided to go to trade school and I'm about to graduate. Having a real job is going to be nice but I know it's going to be really boring for me, the extra money from commissions will be nice but if I can make a living from it it'll just be better.


There are dudes who will commission some really wild stuff. You never see how much was paid for them, but I've seen a few JP artists putting stuff outside their typical content from skeb.

Ah wasn't thinking specifically furry per se. Like background/scenery artwork without characters, or like town/etc type scenes.

Those COULD be viable commissions as those in the scene wouldn't be tied down to any types of characters. Plus depending on it, could mean less work per piece, or an equal amount spent on better detailed work which you could them seek to improve your skills at creating background/scenery at the same time.

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